Threaded Mode | Linear Mode

cpurvis · 03-02-2001, 11:44 AM,

In the past year, I've had several med-full bodied dry reds that exhibited an almost sparkling characteristic right at the tip of the tongue. Acidity hits more mid-palate, tingling the sides of the tongue, so what is this upfront sparkle?

If it helps any, the Marietta Calif. O.V. Red Lot # 25 was pro'bly the most notable example. cp

Innkeeper · 03-02-2001, 11:53 AM,

Had a bottle just the other night, and no tingle or sparkle. Maybe it's your toothpaste.

Botafogo · 03-02-2001, 01:26 PM,

The wine is undergoing secondary fermentation in the bottle (not a good thing). If you stick your EAR in the glass and can hear any fizzing or snap, crackle pop sounds it is a dead give away.....

This is not uncommon in some of the best, high extract, non filtered wines made from very ripe grapes but it is NOT what the winemaker intended.

Roberto

cpurvis · 03-02-2001, 05:22 PM,

Thanks IK, note to file: do not use Crest as between course palate cleanser [img]http://www.wines.com/ubb2/smile.gif[/img]

Roberto, I'm not sure it's what you're talking about either. Surely I would have recognized that. Still puzzled... cp

~~Bucko~~ · 03-02-2001, 05:47 PM,

IK, leave CP alone -- he doesn't have any teeth.....

Bucko

RAD · 03-02-2001, 08:14 PM,

CP, Botafogo's right--secondary fermentation, which is not a good thing. And you noticing the similarities to acidity are spot on, as well. Not that they're the same, which you recognize, but that the SENSATION can be confused. I've actually had several reds that exhibit this, and I steer clear of these producers.

RAD

Botafogo · 03-02-2001, 08:39 PM,

I must disagree re "steering clear of these producers" as, just like the best jazz musicians, some of the best winemakers (actually it is usually the ones who eschew "winemaking" and let nature sort it out) work very close to the edge and ineveitably have a small percentage of such bottles:

Emedio Pepe
Chateau Rayas
Paolo Bea
Tony Coturri
many hot aussies

It's like knowing that Miles Davis may not show up, WILL cuss at the bass player and might be in a bad mood but, GAWD, when he's on he's on.

Roberto

winoweenie · 03-03-2001, 11:46 AM,

If you'll get him to play "Concierta De Aranjuez" I'll come. WW

Thomas · 03-03-2001, 02:37 PM,

Youse guys is confusin' me.

Carbon dioxide bubbles are produced during secondary fermentation--a bubbly sensation on the palate. What does that have to do with acidity? In fact, secondary fermentation lowers acidity.

RAD · 03-03-2001, 03:57 PM,

Foodie, sorry for the confusion. It doesn't have anything to do with acidity. My point was that, in low doses, this secondary fermentation can feel in the mouth kind of like acidity.

As far as the steering clear of these producers, I myself have never experienced this secondary fermentation from what I consider "top-flight" producers. Without a doubt, I don't try as many wines as Botafogo and others on this board--although my wife might not believe me! [img]http://www.wines.com/ubb2/biggrin.gif[/img]

RAD

~~Bucko~~ · 03-03-2001, 04:51 PM,

I think that it is a bottle fairy dancing on his tongue, myself.

Bucko

Botafogo · 03-03-2001, 06:50 PM,

We experience about a 3-5% "failure rate" amongst seriously extracted, unfiltered, naturally fermented wines (which WE consider to be top wines), running the gamut from expensive Aussie old vine Grenache through Puglian monster Zins to the odd Rhone gem. This is just part of the game and is NOT an indication of "poor winemaking" or lack of quality control, it is (as Emedio Pepe says) "letting God speak" and not intervening too much in the vinification.

Roberto

PS, at VinItaly they open and taste EVERY bottle before they pour for you (at quality producers anyway) and between corked bottles and "restarts" they probably reject every 20th bottle as not being what they want to show you. These ARE agricultural products, something many tend to forget......

winoweenie · 03-03-2001, 07:27 PM,

You mean farmers be messin' wif' my juice? WW

Thomas · 03-04-2001, 10:24 AM,

Roberto, will you be at VinItaly this year? If so, let's try to hook up.

Botafogo · 03-04-2001, 12:25 PM,

Of course we will be there (but you won't find us anywhere near the Tuscan or Piemonte pavillions!) on our annual forced march to find thirty new wineries to introduce to the western hemisphere. Where are you staying?

cpurvis · 03-05-2001, 01:44 AM,

RAD & Roberto, Thanks for the unfiltered truth [img]http://www.wines.com/ubb2/wink.gif[/img]

Bucko, if the bottle fairy danced on my tongue & kicked out my teeth,then I haven't had time to notice...a 2 yr old & a 6 month old also inhabit this home.

Speaking of which, WW will be pleased to know that our 2 yr old recognizes red wine as "wine" & SW simply as "juice". This is progress...all of it was originally just "bad apple juice" from his perspective.

Thanks again for the input on the original question. cp

Translate