Cal Cabs Thrashed In Decanter!

[Van The Man]

>>$14-$20 Bordeaux crus certainly exist, but frankly I find them closer to Vendange and Napa Ridge in quality, which we can get for $5.99!<<

Randy - JOOC, when's the last time you bought Napa Ridge? $5.99 was the price something like 4 years ago! ;-)

All kidding aside, I don't agree with this. There were a number of Classifed Bordeaux from '95 and even '96 to a certain degree that were under $20 that were WAY better than any of the fighting varietals. WAY better. How 'bout Chateau Du Tertre? I think I paid $15 for the '95 and this was/is a killer bottle of wine and it will be for many years to come. The '96 wasn't on par with the '95 but at $18 it's still light years ahead of Napa Ridge and Vendage. <g> Chateau Dauzac, another hell of a good wine for the money and much deeper, complex and infinitely more interesting than the CA fighting varietals you cite. '95 Chateau Greysac? '95 Chateau la Cardonne? And how about some of the second wines like the '95 La Bastide Dauzac or even the second wine of Calon Segur? <scratching my head to remember the exact name.> And there are quite a few others from '95, second wines that is, that were/are just super and much better values for the money IMO.

>>Because our situation is such that: To get anything near the quality or even "breed" of a $14-$20 B.V. Rutherford, Chateau Souverain, Buena Vista, or a Gallo Barrelli, you have to spend at least $30 for anything from Bordeaux.<<

Again, I really don't agree here. Sure, if your looking at the tradtional biggies like Pichon Baron, Pichon Lalande, Cos, Talbot, Calon, etc., you're gonna lay out some hard earned cash. But dollar for dollar, especially when you start getting up into the big time dollars that Napa Valley vintners in particular are KILLING themselves trying to get to, Bordeaux offers more value. And I say that with all due respect to Napa Valley. Tell me about even one Cal Cab from Napa Valley that will stand toe to toe with the '95 Chateau Kirwan from Margaux for the $29 I paid for it? I'll be drinking that wine in 30 years while Cal Cabs are dried up and gone.

But that's where the crux of the debate comes into focus. Exactly how does one define "value?"

I recently got into a very interesting debate with a guy in the biz from Napa on another board. We went through the same thing that you and I are doing and when it was all said and done, we agreed completely on the whole issue. He basically said that California (particularly Napa) Cabs are a style in and of their own and that people will pay top dollar for that style, that is, big, highly extracted, oppulent almost fat fruit in a bottle that will drink well over and 5 year life....and "What," he asked "is wrong with that?" I say nothing is wrong with that.

But for my dollar, I need and want something I can lay down by the case, enjoy a bottle on release and then go to it every year or two and track it's development and remember the wine through the 12 bottles I owned. I have purchased too much California Cab that over the years I've ended up being disappointed in and therefore, I'll still buy some of them, but rarely in case quantities.

As for your rant on "stereotypes and generalizations," I agree with you 100%. To paint all Cal Cab with one brush is not wise. But I still believe that the market is driving prices up and let me say it this way, it's getting more and more difficult everyday to find excellent values in California Cabs from California.

And for the record, I still buy some of it, not as much as I used to. And I still find Zinfandel, particularly from the Russian River Valley to be one of the greatest values in wine from anywhere in the world, period.

But this, as with many discussions involving wine, is an interesting topic that's a lot of fun to discuss IMO.