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+--- Thread: Cheese and wine (/thread-298.html)
- Cat - 08-04-1999
Hi,
I have a list of cheeses with suggeted wine types (doesn't need to be), but not specific vintages or brands, this is what I need help with. I am planning a wine and cheese party, indoors, afternoon, price doesn't matter, in CA, and need good quality wine is some criteria. Any info would be greatly appreciated. Sorry for all the questions. Thanks in advance.
FRANCE:
1.) Roquefort and Sauternes
2.) Brie de Meaux fermier and a 20-year-old vintage champagne
3.) Camembert and Bordeaux
4.) Brillat Savarin and a soft-styled Champagne Rosé
5.) Port du Salut and a Bourgueil Rosé
6.) Munster and Gewürtztraminer
ENGLAND:
7.) mature Cheddar and a fine claret
8.) Cheshire and German Riesling
9.) Stilton and Port
NETHERLANDS:
10.) mature Gouda and Shiraz from Australia
Thanks,
Cat (Jessica)
- Tabby - 08-06-1999
Blimey, invite me to your party, will you?! [img]http://www.wines.com/ubb/smile.gif[/img] I could suggest some fabulous Gerwurztraminers you could try, but I doubt you could catch hold of them in CA (I'm from the UK).... What a useless response this is...I was just amused by the similarity of our user names!
[This message has been edited by Tabby (edited 08-06-99).]
- Randy Caparoso - 08-07-1999
Well, Cat, I was waiting for someone to pick up on your request; but since no on else is, let me make my recommendations for wines that would be a little more realistic for you to find in a good California wine store:
1. For a Sauternes substitute, you can't go wrong with the Far Niente "Dolce" from Napa Valley. Also from Napa Valley, the Joseph Phelps "Delice" Semillon is made in the full, sweet, honeyed botrytis style reminiscent of the finest French Sauternes. Even better and perhaps more precious is the Chalk Hill "Botrytized Estate Vineyard Selection" Semillon from Sonoma. All of these have the big, thick, luscious qualities that can effectively counteract the wild, sharp taste of Roquefort.
2. Only collectors have 20 year old vintaged Champagne hanging around. Since I'm assuming you're not one, you might have to do with a "Late Disgorged" style Brut by Bollinger ("RD") in Champagne, which has the golden, roasted hazelnutty qualities of aged Champagne. From California, Iron Horse turns out a rounded, smoky, roasted nut toned "Late Disgorged" Brut. Even better, the Roederer Estate "L'Ermitage" from Mendocino is full of the rich, round, yeasty qualities which should do a decent job with a good, soft authentic Brie.
3. Most wine specialists carry a good selection of Bordeaux. Since there are too many to count, I'd recommend that you talk to your retailer. Ask for the best, most elegant style for your specified price range. $25 to $35 should get you a pretty decent one in a lower grand cru or upper crus bourgeoise range.
4. Champagne Rose -- such as Roederer, Taittinger and Perrier-Jouet -- can be precious (i.e. frighteningly expensive). If you can't spend over $50, you can fine pretty decent drinking examples from California -- such as Iron Horse or even Korbel. In a way, I like these domestic choices just as much as the more costly French. Very round, silky, fruity yet dry and friendly.
5. Bourgueil Rose is a tall, tall order anywhere outside the Loire. If you're around Kermit Lynch Wine Merchant in Berkely, the Chinon Rose by Charles Joguet is an even finer, and just as authentic, choice. But it doesn't have to be exactly this type of pink wine made from the Cabernet Franc grape. Trust me -- although made from different grapes, California selections such as the Robert Sinskey Vin Gris of Pinot Noir, Iron Horse Rosato, Swanson Sangiovese Rosato, and the Beringer Rose de Saignee emulate this bone dry style with its combination of floral, fruity and leafy/herbal aromatic nuances. From Italy, the Regaleali Rosato is also a solid, and juicy flavored, choice. Also from Kermit Lynch, the La Garrigue de la Casenove Roussillon Rose and Domaine de Gautier Rose -- both from the South of France -- should make decent substitutes.
6. There is a bevy of good, solid Alsatian Gewurztraminers available in California retail stores. Ask your merchant what he recommends. Personally, with a wine like Munster I'd go for a slightly sweet style of Gewurztraminer (although the book where you're getting your suggestions from may not exactly have this in mind). Nevertheless, if you can find it, the Pfeffingen Ungsteinger Honigsackel Gewurztraminer Spatlese from Germany's Pfalz region would be guaranteed to blow your mind -- one of the most luscious, spiciest wines in the world. From the same producer (Pfeffingen), an Ungsteiner Herrenberg Scheurebe Spatlese is nearly as good and spicy. From closer to home, I heartily recommend the Louis Martini "Heritage Collection" Gewurztraminer or the Storrs Monterey Gewurztraminer -- both softly sweet, and filled to the brim with floral, lychee-like spice. Just the thing for stinky cheese.
7. Claret? Same answer as for #3. The idea is to get a red Bordeaux that is very smooth, soft, yet properly dry for Cheddar. If this party is starting to send you to the poor house, I advise you to look at a good, smooth red Rioja from Spain. Check with your retailer on that, too. Although made from different grapes (Rioja is made from Tempranillo, whereas Bordeaux is Cabernet Sauvignon and/or Merlot/Cabernet Franc), Rioja pretty much fits the profile.
8. Whatever you do, select a classic style of German Riesling -- something categorized at least at the level of Auslese, Beerenauslese, Trockenbeerenauslese or even Eiswein. Stay away from something classified "trocken," "haltrocken" or just "qualitatswein" -- these would simply not be sweet enough to handle this unusual English blue (Cheshire). Above all, make sure it is German and made from the Riesling grape -- a combination of electrically sharp acidity and incredible fruitiness achieved nowhere else in the world. There are lots and lots of wonderful producers. Some of my personal favorites include Bassermann-Jordan and von Buhl from the Pfalz, Selbach-Oster, S.A. Prum, Zilliken, J.J. Prum, Milz, Balduin von Hovel, or Fritz Haag from the Mosel-Saar-Ruwer, and Robert Weil, Kunstler, or Kesseler from the Rheingau.
9. For a fail-safe choice, make sure your Port is the authentic stuff from Portugal. The big brands are unfailingly delicious; such as Taylor, Fonseca, Graham, Dow, and my pesonal favorite, Ferreira. If you are on a budget, but still want something solid, ask for a "Late Harvest Vintage Port" style, which are moderately aged, smooth and full of bouncy fruit. For maximum smoothness in the $15-$35 range, ask for an "aged" Tawny Port -- sold as, say, "10 Years Old Tawny," "15 Years Old Tawny," "20 Years Old," etc. -- which are cask aged to a velvety, nut toned richness.
10. Shiraz. Lots of good ones out there. Producers like Rosemount and Penfolds are ubiquitous -- but unfailingly good. Also look for D'Arenberg, Sandalford, Cape Mentelle, and if you're lucky enough to find one, Henschke.
Finally, if you feel bold enough to veer away from your initial guidelines -- which are all good, but not necessarily the only things possible -- allow me to offer these alternatives:
Roquefort: Sauternes or Botrytized Semillon are not the only game in town for this salty cheese. I'm particularly fond of Liqueur Muscat or Liqueur Tokay from Australia (Chambers is a brand found here and there in California). Also, sweet Italian Muscats do just fine -- such as Anselmi's "I Capeitelli" Recioto di Soave, Librandi's "Le Passule" Vino Passito -- as does the classic, golden, almondy rich Vin Santo from Northern Italy (Antinori and Badia Coltibuono are solid brands). From Portugal, there is the Moscatel de Setubal "Alhambre" (Jose Maria Fonseca is the leading brand), which gives raisiny, honeyed, burnt cream richness.
Brie and Camembert: Cutting, slicing, nutty/yeasty toned Champagne is good thinking with slightly ammonia-like, runny Brie. You might find an interesting match in a good, dry, slightly acidic styles of white wine from France's Loire region -- such as those made from the Sauvignon Blanc (Sancerre, Pouilly-Fume, Quincy, Cheverny, or Menetou-Salon), or in a minerally, dry style fromthe Chenin Blanc (Vouvray "Sec" or Savennieres). For a red wine alternative, you'd need something fairly light, but tender, with a gently acidic edge; which means a slinky, smooth, spicy scented Pinot Noir from Oregon or Santa Barbara (ask your merchant for a recommendation), or a Cabernet Franc based red (Chinon, Bourgueil, or Saumur-Champigny) from the Loire.
Brillat-Savarin: Triple creme does present a different bag of tricks from normal soft ripened cheese. To tell you the truth, though, Champagne Rose is far from my top personal choice. At an almost ripe, still firm stage, it is surprisingly good with full bodied, slighly smoky, barrel aged Chardonnay -- especially the tropical toned styles from Western Australia and Santa Barbara. At a fully ripened, oozing stage, it actually does a beautiful job with good, classic Bordeaux -- especially from St. Julien or Pauillac, which become smokier and more tobacco-like with the cheese -- as well as almost any big, aggressive, middle aged California Cabernet Sauvignon (especially cedary/minty classics like Beaulieu, Silver Oak, Chateau Souverain, Niebaum-Coppola, or Caymus, and even huge, fleshy, somewhat contemporary brands like Dalla Valle, Spottswoode, Araujo and Pahlmeyer). At any rate, the idea is that a white or red that tends to be voluminously rich in flavor can be expanded even further with a cheese like the noble Brillat-Savarin.
Cheshire: I can't resist commentary. Sweet German Rieslings may be ideal, but Tokaji "5 Puttonyos" (especially by Disznoko or the Royal Tokaji Wine Co.) can also offer that balance of razor sharp acidity and concentrated natural sugar to cut through this cheese. In a similar vein, Vouvray "Trie de Vendange" (such as Champalou's) or a rare Jurancon "La Quintessence" (by Domaine Bru-Bache from South-West France) achieve the same needlepoint balance. This is rare stuff, but I don't know the extent to which you are willing to go. People are always surprising me.
Stilton: Port is good, but Banyuls (my favorite producer is Domaine La Tour Vieille) from South-West France does a pretty good job of rivaling these classic fortified reds. From Paso Robles in California, you might be shocked by the quality of the Justin "Obtuse" -- a fortified made from the Cabernet Sauvignon. In any case, don't forget to throw in some cracked walnuts and/or pieces of bittersweet chocolate (ever try Hawaiian Vintage Chocolate?) on the same plate. As Justin Wilson says, I "gaur-rantee" it!
Anyway, I apologize if this answer has somehow turned into something of a treatise. This is what happens when you get someone like me started. Let me know how things go, and if you have any other specific questions as a result of your visitations to your local merchants. I'm far from an expert on cheese, but I'm pretty good with the wine -- and about knowing what I've liked!
[This message has been edited by Randy Caparoso (edited 08-07-99).]
[This message has been edited by Randy Caparoso (edited 08-07-99).]
- Cat - 08-09-1999
Thanks so much for your reply, Randy, you have helped a lot. If you know of any specific years of any of them that you know are great please share them with me. Thanks again.
Also, Tabby, thanks for your note, like your username also.
- Randy Caparoso - 08-10-1999
Actually, mine's was a quite contemporary reply. And so the wines that I have mentioned are available now in quite good "vintage" years, no matter what they may be. The important things are their origins and the names of the producers.