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"That Wine is Out of Stock" - Printable Version

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- Woodman - 01-04-1999

Continuing from the chardonnay thread (which started out as a champagne thread) here's one for y'all. I'd love to get your comments.

The '96 Pierre Damoy Burgundies just hit town. I've had the Clos de Beze recommended very highly to me, and was thinking of buying some with the insane money I'm getting by auctioning off some of my '95 Whitehall Lane Reserve.

What makes this a better story is that the wine is directly imported by a company here in Portland, so we get to miss a markup and it's selling for the same price as what WineClub sells it for. Further, since I have one retailer who will sell me 6 bottles ordered in advance for cost plus 10%, I can buy this (in theory at least) for less than $60, which would qualify as a screaming deal on Grand Cru Burgundy of this caliber.

Here's the rub -- I'm going to call my retailer today and see if he can get some. What odds is anyone giving me that it will be "out of stock"? Guaranteed, they didn't move their whole stock of $80 wine in a few days so it's more likely "we have 10 cases but we've reserved it for restaurants and our good customers".

Anyone?????


- IVYCHEF - 01-04-1999

Bob,

I could go off for days about this, too. And you'd think that since I have the "luxury" of working with them and actually knowing a thing or two about wine, they'd cut me some slack. No way. I have nothing against my sales reps personally, they are all pretty nice guys - and I'm sure it isn't their rule - just the suits who run the distributorship. I have my "solution" and have been doing it for the last two years..but I doubt it would do you much good as I use my professional position to strike back.

About 1/4 of my wine list is from auctions, or somewhere else.

For big events, the same applies. They can't sell me what I want over the year, they don't get my business when I need special wines.

Since I have an audience-teach junior college on occasion, cooking classes at local gourmet shops, lead a very basic beginners wine tasting class once a month.
I, and only if asked:

a. won't recommend (or dine at) the restaurants that get these allocated wines

b. will tell people: You can't get wine X in Peoria or surrounding area because...and then tell them to complain at their favorite wine store if so compelled to do so.

c. won't recommend their "little siblings wines" if the "allocated older brother" isn't available to the general public.

d. encourage people to find these wines if they want them at auction, at Sam's or POP's, or somewhere else and provide them with resources to do so.

Is it working? I would like to think that I had some little bity part in now seeing wines like Beringer and Mondavi Reserves, Domaine Drouhin, Woodward Canyon and SOME big name Bordeauxs and Burgundies on the shelves. (Actually, its probably because these wines won't sell at the absurd restaurant prices in beer drinking Peoria.)

Good luck in your fight against the establishment.

Kevin


- Botafogo - 01-04-1999

Guys, if you have the cajones, try this gambit:

Remind the distributor that in most jurisdictions, wine is a controlled substance, every bottle has a paper trail registered with the government, you can find out what he has and where and that the law in many places compells him to sell it to anyone who can pruduce a license and the money.

Yes he can OFFER it to his allocation list first but the legality of HOLDING it is questionable in most areas. Do a little reasearch and offer to fax the relevant statutes and inventory information to the State Attorney General and Alcoholic Beverage Agencies. This is playing REALLY hard ball but has been known to work from time to time.

I love the smell of Napalm in the morning, Roberto


- Ashby Lawson - 01-04-1999

Roberto, *Definitely* a last-ditch, end-game approach here in Tuscaloosa, where there are so few wholesalers. We gotta work with 'em, if we expect them to do us a favor and bring in some Anselmi Recioto di Soave, or whatever. In fact, there's only one wholesaler here with a decent-sized book, so its definitely a touchy situation.


- Woodman - 01-04-1999

In this case, it was a false alarm. For the very first time, they actually came through. I was able to "steal" this wine at pre-arrival pricing (I was off a little, $62) but after its arrival. Amazing. Sometimes there really is some justice.


- Botafogo - 01-04-1999

I AM spoiled: we have over a hundred distributors and hundreds of winery direct sources here so slash and burn tactics won't put you out of business and once you're a "player" or "destination outlet" most folks want to be included dispite the occasional run-in. As, for Florida, God help you!

Ciao, Roberto


- Enophile - 01-04-1999

Bob, whoever told you this just came in is a little off. It's been in town at least a month, as someone picked a bottle up a month ago for our '96 Red Burg tasting. Did you get any indication of how much was left?


- Ashby Lawson - 01-04-1999

A hundred distributors and hundreds of winery sources? Now you're pissing me off [img]http://www.wines.com/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img]...
As for Fla., oh, to be there, where, from what I'm told, the wine biz is thriving. We're in Alabama, a damn fine place to live (really), and a damn pitiful place to buy wholesale wine (REALLY).


- IVYCHEF - 01-05-1999

100s, huh? We have one major house from Chicago, one large and four small local independents. Wouldn't know what to do with 100s.

Kevin


- Botafogo - 01-05-1999

Ivy, I would be willing to bet that in a city the size of Chi-town with a sizable Italian-American population that if you went and asked the owners / wine buyers at your better Italian restaurants you would flush four or five one-man-show importers out of the bushes. Here in California there must be twenty or thirty of them, mostly servicing the ethnic market (you know, Valentino and Drago where lunch is $100!). And I am CERTAIN there are some Polish Americans there bringing in all sorts of odd Eastern Euro Spirits who have importing licenses and could clear stuff for you. Here we have TWO Sake specialists!

Seek and ye shall find, Roberto


- winoweenie - 01-05-1999

Here in lovely Az we have a very tight 3-tiered system of distribution. If you don`t have a first-name relationship with one of the 3 or 4 major retailors you can forget your bottles of Dalle, Caymus S>S> or any of the reserves. Someone asked about the 94 Beringer Reserve....We opened one Fri. As usual, great juice...( No comment on the price of it or any of the other premies ) See all of the I.Q. empowered from the gang at Jerry`s are loggrd on. HNY


- Ashby Lawson - 01-05-1999

Ivychef, Well, at least you have Vin Divino right there in Chicago, one of the best importers of quality Italian wine.


- Jerry D Mead - 01-05-1999

Welcome winoweenie...hope to see you and your tasting notes here often. I do like your new handle, by the way.

JDM


- IVYCHEF - 01-05-1999

Dear people -

I'm 3 hours south of Chicago....nobody's running me down a case of Salice Salentino [img]http://www.wines.com/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

Kevin


- Botafogo - 01-05-1999

>>If you don`t have a first-name relationship with one of the 3 or 4 major retailors you can forget your bottles of Dalle, Caymus S>S> or any of the reserves. <<

Then put your energies into some serious spelunking into the stuff those guys carry that is not only BETTER but CHEAPER, they all have some, most of them don't even know it and will take offers. Ask for samples of every obscure South African, Spanish, Aussie or Southern Italian thing you can, taste them, find the gems and show your customers you are not a service bureau for the Speculum.

This philosophy has earned us a rabid following, could work for you too. Imagine yourself as an alternative record store, you don't sell Michael Jackson, you sell M'Chelle Ndege Ocello, you don't have Kenny G, You have Kenny Baron. You've find a much more loyal group of customers if YOU have a point of view.


Why can't it be Sunday yet? Roberto

[This message has been edited by Botafogo (edited 01-05-99).]


- Ron Zimmerman - 01-05-1999

Roberto, does "Botafogo" mean "hot foot" (or something similar)?


- Botafogo - 01-05-1999

No, it means "swift fire" or "spitfire" in Portuguese and is a neighborhood in Rio that used to be the home of itinerant fishermen until a "swift fire" transformed it into The Yacht Club. Funny how those things "happen"! In Italian (spelled Buttafuoco) it is both a loudmouth wannabee actor from Long Island and a wonderful up and coming wine zone in Emilia-Romagna.

I will be IN Botafogo (and Copa and Ipanema and Buzios) on Sunday, can't wait, Roberto


- tomvegabyrnes - 04-21-1999

Roberto, What would you say is the biggest complaint restaurants have with wine importers and wholesalers, and where would you see a niche based on personalized service to restaurants,for a new small wine importer in a place like Chicago? Any thoughts appreciated. Tom VB


- Jason - 04-21-1999

What is it with you guys and you're little anti-distributor streak? I assume you all have good customers and treat them as such.
If this is the case, then why do you begrudge the distribs for doing the same? The big guys get first dibs as a thank you, it just makes sense.
Plenty of little guys get some to. People that are good customers always get taken care of. Are you really telling me that retailers don't hold back, and sell all their cherries to anybody that walks through the door? Come on now, get real. Restaurants don't hold tables or food for special customers? Of course this happens, yet when distribs do it, you get your panties in a wad.
The "hardball trick" is like those restaurant guests who call in a fake food poisoning complaint to the health inspector because they feel slighted in some way. How would that person then be treated in the restaurant?
This business is all about relationships. Once you sour that, you are worse off for it.


- Jerry D Mead - 04-22-1999

Jason...You make some valid arguments, but it's still hard to swallow when one sees hard to find, allocated product stacked up in Costco or wherever, when local fine restaurants and fine wine shops are getting bottles or none at all.

And frustrating when the wholesalers are so busy selling the big brands that are their bread and butter (once again hard to blame them)and allowing really great brands with no marketing clout (re no powerful whiskey companion or high volume brand connected)to languish in the warehouse to where when I review current releases no one can find them because the wholesalers are running two to three vintages behind.

I'd say the biggest problem with wholesalers is that there are not enough of you. All the consolidation to where each market has three serious wholesalers...means laundry lists of brands in every house to where you basically become order takers and not salesman.

The only thing most wholesalers sell is the high volume stuff that's on "post off" or "deal" for the month, or that has some big extra "spiff" or free trip connected for the salesman.

It's the system in general that is the problem...it's not that wholesalers are inherently evil or something...they provide a great service that is needed...but the middle tier of the 3-tier system is a dinosaur that just can't be everything to everyone.

The Wine Curmudgeon