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- Thomas - 12-09-2005
J,
I am saying that the word "organic" should not be used as a replacement for sound winemaking practices.
[This message has been edited by foodie (edited 12-09-2005).]
- j413760 - 12-09-2005
Foodie,
Any chance you could elaborate on the last reply? If you don't want to do it in the post you can email me. I'm just confused about what you said. Is there no truly organic wine? I’m very new to the wine world, so I don’t really know all too much about it.
J
- Thomas - 12-10-2005
J,
It's a complicated issue, but here's a stab at it.
Many people think that wines are pumped with chemicals and additives, a situation not so subtley fostered by certain anti-alcohol groups. But true winemaking requires few, if any, chemicals. Mainly, chemical treatment will take place when something has gone wrong and needs fixing and even then it is judicious and under govt regulation.
But as to "organic" let's take one example.
Sulfur dioxide (SO2) is used by the overwhelming majority of winemakers and has been used in winemaking since the 2nd century in Rome. It also appears naturally in our stomachs when we digest, in cheese, yogurt, bread, and in wine as a by-product of fermentation. The natural levels of SO2 in wine are not sufficient to hold off oxidation so winemakers add a little more. Now, if SO2 occurs naturally as a by-product of fermentation, is that or is that not an organic process? Is adding to an organic process inorganic?
To make matters more confusing, the federal govt. mandates Contains Sulfites on wine labels when the SO2 tops a certain minimum level in wine, so if the SO2 is under that level, then the warning is not required. Is it misleading to claim the wine is not organic when the warning appears on the label, organic when the warning does not, yet in each case there may be SO2 in the wine?
To add to the confusion, when the sulfite mandate came about, a winery that did not distribute outside its home state was exempt from having to put the dire words on its labels. But the SO2 might still have been in there at higher levels than the minimum allowed for exclusion of the mandate.
Some companies use these rulings and the overall confusion of matters like this to subvert the real meaning of organic, which to me means that nothing man-made or unnatural is added in food or wine processing.
Organic in the vineyard is another matter entirely but the same should hold true about using or not using unnatural products in sprays or dumped on the soil.
Biodynamic viticulture is a lot more specific than organic, but neither viticultural practices address the winemaking process.
[This message has been edited by foodie (edited 12-10-2005).]
- Innkeeper - 12-10-2005
Look at the mess you got us into Akaran. [img]http://www.wines.com/ubb2/biggrin.gif[/img] You come from a lovely city though. Loved Istanbul on a couple of visits.
- j413760 - 12-10-2005
Wow foodie that is an eyeful! It does give me a whole lot of re-search to do. I really enjoy being new at things, the learning curve is so phenomenal. Whenever I become interested in a new hobby or anything I find myself knee deep in reading material for it. Learning new things is always fun for me. As for the sulfites being organic, where do they come from when they are added? If the source is an organic type source the sulfites even though added by man can still be considered organic. The grounds for organic certification vary greatly from the various groups. To be USDA organic certified is fairly easy from what I understand. Anyways thanks for the info. I feel extremely bad for hijacking akarans post…sorry.
J
- Thomas - 12-10-2005
J,
This is a definition of the natural formation of SO2:
Geothermal activity, including hot springs and volcanic; produced from the natural decay of vegetation on land, and in oceans. (This should not be confused with the result of burning fuels that causes acid rain, which is of course an unnatural process of creating SO2)
In wine SO2 is added either as a clean gas or as a powder (potassium metabisulfite), but I do not know the processing required to get those products to the wine industry.
- Jackie - 12-11-2005
Check out The Organic Wine Company at http://theorganicwinecompany.com
There is a very good discussion of exactly what organic means....
Apparently, "organic" is becoming almost a useless term when it comes to wine.
- Thomas - 12-11-2005
Jackie,
That is just about my point--but never underestimate the word's marketing power [img]http://www.wines.com/ubb2/wink.gif[/img]